Thursday, 25 October 2007

Some of you guys have been asking for logs of IRC last night

So here it is, shamelessly lifted from http://dot-slash-csc.iblogger.org/oinkfaq.html

friggy> you just get bailed for free?
OiNK> yes
--
smartface> does the paypal account have any funds on it ATM?
OiNK> it had some, and the account has been permanently limited
smartface> did they actually question you?
OiNK> of course, for hours
OiNK> the police had very limited technical knowledge, which made the interview quite amusing actually.
OiNK> i wasn't willing to teach them how to use a computer
OiNK> they actually wanted me to teach them how to set up a website
OiNK> i just told them to google it.
smartface> have you become a millionarie with our donations?
OiNK> no
smartface> are you planned for a trial anytime soon?
OiNK> the earliest date for trial is 26th december - though highly unlikely
--
Xenafor> IS YOUR FATHER OKAY AS WELL?
OiNK> my father is fine.
OiNK> my father was not arrested, though they did take his work laptop
Xenafor> Are you a vegetarian?
OiNK> yes.
--
apelure> what does the carges about fraud mean?
OiNK> i've not been charged ...
--
knifeboy> Did they do the good cop/bad cop routine?
OiNK> no
--
Stormx2> Everyone is first and foremost concerned for you and everything, but at the back of our minds (I think) we're interested in what you think will happen the the pink palace. Obviously you won't have a starring roll, but will the backups be destroyed?
OiNK> why would backups be destroyed?
--
j2los> do you think at minimum the forums will be restored as a community for discussing music?
OiNK> i don't know
j2los> do you think it is absurd that only now that the site has been taken down has it been deemed notable enough for a wikipedia article?
OiNK> i found that amusing, yes
OiNK> i'm glad the article is staying neutral
--
guildmast> Are there any plans for an official OiNK donations fund we can feel comfortable donating to?
OiNK> not yet
--
ftdrs> seriously though, what did they accuse you of?
OiNK> conspiracy to defraud and copyright infringements
--
maxdoubt> do you have/need legal representation?
OiNK> i'm still deciding on legal advice
--
Kevix> did you have any warning before hand that the knock opn your door was coming?
OiNK> no
--
Yawg> did you anticipate a raid in the past? Did you take any precautions regarding site design and logs and whatnot to protect the community?
OiNK> the logs we store aren't enough to inciminate users
--
Gl1mw0rm> are you still the rigtfull owner of the oink.cd domain?
OiNK> unclear
--
Barth> what about the recent security/privacy changes to the site and the irc? was that a coincidence or did you see something coming?
OiNK> coincidence
--
midnightgt> (without incriminating anyone) is there any copy of the source anywhere? Would you be in support of a second coming of the website? How do you think this reflects on the war on file sharing? (Certainly I do not feel like we are losing)
OiNK> sorry, no comment :)
--
lhnz> Why exactly did the cops want you to make a website for them?:P :D
OiNK> dunno
--
ATF> did you get fired from work?
OiNK> yes
--
gleam> do you think you or anyone else will ever hear from tmt again? :)
OiNK> no
--
MooIsTooWrong> do you think most of the people in this channel are asking asshat questions?
OiNK> yes
--
uQ1> What grounds did your work fire you?
OiNK> i'm not going to go into that, sorry.

And now, something from this morning (after he'd seen the guardian article)
OiNK> they got my company wrong, but besides that, it's quite a good article
OiNK> the police were here around 30 mins ago, and they were not happy one bit when they left
OiNK> they asked me how i was coping with all the media coming around
OiNK> i said "i don't mind it at all, i'm just telling them the truth, unlike you"

34 comments:

Anonymous said...

At that last bit .. pwnt.

Anonymous said...

Hehe... what a legend

Anonymous said...

Sounds like Oink is doing quite well so far...

Keep fighting guys!

Dag said...

To bad he got fired:(

Anonymous said...

"I'm telling the truth, unlike you".
Oooh, burn...

Anonymous said...

Gotta love the British police - intelligent as ever. I personally never used Oink but I support this bloke and hope he can beat this. Finally showing that the British have some guts in this area!

WakuWaku said...

"I'm telling the truth, unlike you"

Kudoos 4 you, master OINK.
Sounds you got your mind clear and thats important now. All good vibes to you and be careful with the media ..... lot of mistakes all over the place :-) Respect for keeping us up to date.

A dedicated OINK-er .....
Greetz to all :bounce:-ers

Anonymous said...

"Yawg> did you anticipate a raid in the past? Did you take any precautions regarding site design and logs and whatnot to protect the community?
OiNK> the logs we store aren't enough to inciminate users"

I certainly hope you couldn't get pregnant off any of your logs...That made my day =)

Though I never could become an OiNK'er, I have much respect for you guys. Take care.

Anonymous said...

Nice to know that the logs are not enough to incriminate users. Although I imagine e-mail addresses were stored as plain text, which to me (and I imagine others) is still a worry.

Anonymous said...

British law says that if anything is encrypted you must give the police the password to decrypt it or you'll go to jail.s

Anonymous said...

If you get the chance, please tell this OiNK character I believe he is very brave.

-mhtpk

Anonymous said...

It's not encryption, though. It's just a salted hash. There is no decryption key.

Anonymous said...

Lol at the end. Best of luck in your fight with the law etc etc.

I would definitely be willing to contribute to a fund for legal costs etc. Apart from anything else I think this would change the way filesharing comes across in the media. It would show how important mutual cooperation etc is to sites like oink and destroy the impression conveyed by many of the news outlets that oink was just a moneymaking scheme thought up by a self-serving evil genius.

Anonymous said...

I completely agree with the previous comment.

I used Oink and thought it was the best thing I'd ever seen on the internet- a perfect example of cooperation and mutual aid. I'd be only too pleased to contribute to a legal defense fund, or at least a fund to pay fines.

There was incidentally some talk last year among some UK anarchists about attempting to set up a social-insurance scheme (a la the Swedish fare-dodgers Union that operates on the metro there) for torrent downloaders. The idea was to use a pledgebank-style initial proposal that people would all follow up on (say £10?) when enough people agreed to participate (say 1000?)...

Anonymous said...

"It's not encryption, though. It's just a salted hash. There is no decryption key."

That only applies to passwords, which probably isn't much use to authorities anyhow. Email addresses are not hashed if they are ever displayed on the site, and logs are not hashed, or else there would be not purposed of keeping them.

Anonymous said...

In for OiNK v2! Best of luck with your fight! Sorry about your job. :\

Anonymous said...

dont drop the soap

Anonymous said...

OiNK 2???? anyone?

im heart broken. My oink account was like my baby. i nurtured that bitch into poweruser+!!!!! and what about all the great forum threads??? like "REVENGE!" (on the cleaning lady for stealing the rolos)....??? dang. there will never be another place like the pink palace.

Anonymous said...

So he says they got his company name wrong, but he doesn't say where he actually worked... I thought it was a laugh when i read he worked at Virgin Media though.

As to logs not being able to "inciminate" users, I do wonder how that works.

Anonymous said...

Take the profits from the account and buy a server in Sweden :)

zaP said...

"So he says they got his company name wrong, but he doesn't say where he actually worked... I thought it was a laugh when i read he worked at Virgin Media though."

Does it matter anything where he worked?

"As to logs not being able to "inciminate" users, I do wonder how that works."

Yeah well, typos can happen :)

brian said...

because of the details and instances given from the past few days, i will begin working on what i hope to be an important project to protect the pertinent rights we all know to be fair and accurate. i firmly believe it is now the artists obligation to prove to major labels and to entities such as the riaa in my country and the bpi, and the ifpi that speaking for musicians that have not hired you to speak for them is not only inaccurate but should be considered an assumption only given by someone who is obviously lying. that such an entity exists as these organizations that have done whatever possible to scare the majority that is sadly innocently uneducated about file SHARING. if we take ten deep breaths and stare at the solidly obscured facts (which must by now be one of the most inaccurate media coverages in internet history), you will notice that with every single public action taken by the riaa and ifpi there have been quite obvious efforts made to tactfully scare a large group of people (potential "digital evil doers"), not punish a sole individual. for instance, how many times have you seen a raid, following an investigation led by "interpol", televised? these singular convictions are NOT intended to solve the crime that these organizations state they exist for. they simply advertise the completely ridiculous agenda that they abide by, which as we all know is only financially driven. there is not a single artistic bone in anyone's body working for a major label overseen by the riaa of ifpi, or the organization hired to protect the fantastical flights of fancy one would loosely, and without any legal merit or investigation, call "digital rights". this has sparked a rage in me that will not die. i will not write an article in protest and let no one read it, and my project will do the best it can to assist in non-malicious file sharing for creative or artistic curiosity. oink to me was a daily attraction. i enjoyed very much the two years i spent as a member, and over those two years became exposed to artistry that left me feeling sad, happy, and a mirage of emotions that i possibly would not have gained otherwise. i feel a duty to protect anyone or anything that allowed me the rare opportunity to have constantly new feelings and emotions. this is to say the least, disgusting. we were good people, we were "friends sharing our music". we seeded because we cared (or because we wanted the title of "poweruser"), and regardless of motive, we allowed others the innocent ability to hear something they otherwise may never have heard. but we do not only have the riaa and the ifpi to blame, we do have major label pre-release groups to blame as well. pre-releases are a ridiculous waste of time, downloaded by impatient sudo-nerds to be given the right to say "i downloaded something 2 weeks early that you couldn't even purchase at target". pre-release groups don't care about music, as much as the riaa doesn't care about music. STOP DOWNLOADING PRE-RELEASES. if there is anything you want to do to help it would simply be that. just wait two weeks and download the ripped store release. it's the uploading of pre-releases that are the only initiative of "legal right" the riaa/ifpi have to incriminate someone upon. they would have a much harder time incriminating anyone at all if we as a community did not accept nor download as a majority, pre-releases. in this instance of the tear down of oink, the investigation (however long it really was) never would have gained merit for incrimination had it not been for sneaky pre-releases on the server. oink explained at the fucking upload page that you are advised not to upload certain albums or certain pre-releases, BEFUCKINGCAUSE those releases are backed by psychotic organizations that want to shut down file sharing altogether, regardless of the fact that many albums are provided by the artists themselves or labels that see file sharing only as good advertising. STOP DOWNLOADING PRE-RELEASES, it's simple. major pre-releases generally are awful anyway. so back to my original posting about a potential project. the project will consist of a small amount of albums created by musicians including myself who understand that it is the responsibility of the ARTIST to stand up for artists rights, not office meetings. these albums will be designed by similar minds, and copied cheaply but sustaining no less quality than you'd find in a major release. these albums will be free. free. free. they will not be limited, they will be given to whomever wants one by the artist or overseeing independent label. money will be made by form of donation for said album, donations for the project, merchandise, and shows. but most importantly the album will prove a point, being that a reasonable artist has the unique advantage of speaking out in response to "digital rights". we as musicians can create good music, and in what i am aiming and hoping for, very good music. so good that people would be surprised that this music was free in the form of a hard copy. this should prove many points that i hope to enlist in the understanding of the project. basically, free music by a subtle organization with an agenda to reeducate the massive amounts of poor souls brain washed by the riaa and ifpi. i want people to understand that major labels are not the be all and end all of music, and i want people to understand that these labels DO NOT care about music. mtv does not care about music. vh1 does not care about music. universal/sony/capital records seems to not care about music so much that they will do anything to not let you listen to it, unless at a high cost. artists care about music. independent labels care about music. oink users cared about music. i realize that most of you understand and realize these things. but unfortunately we have to call on help from people who never needed to know that there were other forms of music, that were content with music television for their sole proprietor of creativity. but these are the majority, and they need to understand that real, honest, artists are outraged. you will hear more about this. i will provide no contact information, just please be on the lookout, and when you find me, please help. i care.

brian

Anonymous said...

No offense, but wow. Wall of text crits you for over 9000.

Anonymous said...

:lmao: awesome WoW/RPG reference :D Hope OiNK beats this and if not moves to somewhere with no extradition treaty :D

brian said...

for everyone who sees my previous post as a "wall of text", FUCK YOU. if all you can see with a largely written statement is an over amount of words, than your sympathy for this issue is obviously limited to clever sudo-witty three sentence comment. which is incredibly unhelpful. i have yet to find a comment or even an article citing a genuine thought or idea that wasn't limited to a simple discernment of the issue.

which isn't going to change or help anything or anyone related to the problem. thanks for proving that most internet users will glance right by a hefty statement, because it's a "wall of text", and than you for not being part of any solution.

did you notice the paragraph breaks? fucking idiot. maybe this time you'll comment on content, and not amounts of letters.

Botti said...

Power to you Brian. I loved your 'wall' and I stand by it 100%. Get heard.

Patrick said...

i agree with you brian
much love OINK!

Hans said...

Ehh.. Brian, chill. Your text was good but saying nothing much new, and it was poorly formatted, which doesn't entice anybody to read it. It's really beside the point here in any event, but lets not get caught up in the little stuff, eh? Your points were still both valid and just and on point.

Now, as for legal fund, certainly. Oink is an unique venture in both spirit and execution and deserves the best legacy a more realistic and up-to-date legal presedence can create, which means that this issue is bigger than oink, thus it deserves all the attention and assistance all of us usually self-serving and lazy users can provide.

Consider that my 2c on the topic.
Ameneon@Oink

Anonymous said...

gutted oink, should have had an invitation system ,but instead you didn't and that's why it got taken down, godamn I can't wait for all the music on there to now trickle down into public trackers, and other sites I'm a member of. like i said. GUTTED OINK!

Brian said...

hans,

Let me choose my words carefully, as you've irritated the shit out of me. firstly, SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT FORMATTING. I almost want to quit using the internet all together simply due to the massive amount of complaining about textual format. In a space with only so many characters wide the only option is to separate paragraphs, which unfortunately I did not do. I did not realize the validity of statements would suspend recognition upon witnessing, GASP, a lack of paragraphs.

Secondly, do not tell me to "chill". The solution to this problem requires an internet user who is not lazy, someone who will not... chill. And my question is your's as well. Why waste space getting caught up in irrelevance? So... why did you do? Why did you waste my fucking time reading your distaste for my formatting abilities? If I was on point, what was the point of your first two sentences? Shit like this is NOT going to change anything... It makes internet users appear unable to actually form a valid community without someone mucking it up with besides the point irrelevant statements.

Why attempt to break someone's spirit or discourage them from trying something that could possibly assist greatly in the battle against the riaa and the ifpi? Especially if you also want to see this put to an end. It just doesn't make any sense. Since you are obviously doing everything you can to help, tell me, of what I said or have planned, already exists? Tell me of a project that creates wonderful music with it's SOLE PURPOSE to distribute it freely amongst whomever would like it, proving that lies are obvious and abundant if in fact potentially very good music could be distributed freely under the musicians own volition. There is not a group of the sort, not even anything remotely close to the idea. This is a large scale idea, and if fully functioning could create an enormous landmark amongst the controversy. How many statements have you read during your research on the subject that have led you to believe that they have an idea that may actually help the situation, if not eradicate it completely. How many groups are attempting to educate the majority of the dangers of actually downloading pre-releases, aside from the iraa and ifpi? Fucking nobody significant...

Don't you get it? My plan consists of educating enough people about the dangers of downloading pre-releases, which is exactly what these organizations want, and therefore cannot stop me from my real agenda, which is shutting them the fuck down. And the whole time I'll be working on my project enlisting musicians as well as myself to create a record label and an organization that hopefully would reach thousands, speaking openly against these groups while at the same time proving that real artists care about the music before profits.

So don't tell me to chill, I WILL progress in my venture, and I WILL make a statement heard by many. I may not change a damn thing, but I'm sure as hell going to try, which is a whole lot fucking more than I can say for you.

brian

Hans said...

Good god Brian, I don't know which monkey bit you but you might wanna see a doctor. If you can't take even criticism this mild and present your subject in a fashion that people will actually read, what makes you think you will make any headway? You think *your intentions* are gonna count for jack shit if your intended recepient blows it off for another internet troll?

I'm not saying stop your mission, and if you read that in what I said, you need glasses too. I said, if you want to get the maximum impact of your mission, you need to hone the delivery method as well as the message. You tell me any notable speakers or leaders who got heard by content alone.

You wish to succeed in your venture. I wish you to succeed in your venture. However much I wish it however, I doubt you'll have any luck, as there in any marketplace (and don't fool yourself, this is a marketplace) there is a supply side, and a demand side. As long as there is a demand, there will be a supply. As long as there is supply, there will be a demand. If you can't stop the people providing the prereleases, you won't be able to stop people wanting them.

More on point however, you *can* affect people like oink, to disallow such content on their sites in order to make it harder for the average joe to find it, thus making it less interesting for the suppliers of said content to go to the risk and trouble of providing it. *THAT* might have some chance of suceeding.

So, feel free to blast off in another headless rage, if I have any idea of how to reach an audience, and I do, you'll still be struggling with this long after the legal battles inevietably and irreversably have taken us to where sites such as oink in and of themselves no longer are considered illegal in most countries (not even by politicians) and the record industry and politicians finally have tired of trying to stop the technological evolution.

Ameneon@Oink

brian said...

I sincerely do not think you quite understand. The actual dilemma exists amongst musicians, and that foremost is what I am trying to alleviate. Give independent musicians power of voice, and ultimately voice the people against the source. And frankly, your calm amongst the storm is laughable and once again irritating. Trust me, I have yet to explode.

So, basically you are saying that instead of aiming for the heart of the problem, to instead only creatively lead and accept traffic elsewhere? And that you agree in saying that pre-releases will inevitably non exist by way of simply not allowing it? Geez... well there you go, you solved it for us all. You, my friend are a hero. In fact, why don't you find every single person on the internet who has a pertinent idea, and then advertise all around them that it may not work. Hmm... I think I know of another entity with the same agenda... could it be the ifpi, or even possibly the riaa?

I'm not quite sure why you've assumed I've yet to realize a product requires a market? And why did you waste both of our time (again) explaining to me economics in an obnoxious nutshell? Where in my previous statements did you not realize that half of my agenda was to alleviate the downloading of pre-releases? You can't just say that "it won't work", and then arrogantly explain supply and demand to someone who obviously just might understand the topic.

Your last paragraph scares me, and has led me to understand that I am now battling another force, and dealing with apparently a very naive silly person. You really think that if we just keep building and re-building our freedom, that the government and the organizations will just assume defeat? That, my friend, is absolutely positively and utterly completely ridiculous. The organizations are backed by BILLIONS in major label revenue, and the government is... well the government, and has proven in every relevant nation that they will take sides with the billion dollar conglomerates. They are slowly winning, while we are naively assuming that information will reoccur with the same freedoms we are exhibiting as I type. Technology is constantly growing like wildfire. In ten years we have absolutely no way to predict what the internet will be, and most importantly if it will be free.

My execution may be harsh, but it is not a tactic. These are the words I feel most important to iterate. Once again, if we agree that the organizations need to go away, why are you rebutting my attempts? Why are you interfering in my progress? This problem is much much larger than the freedoms of private trackers, which is the only basis you have been able to argue.

My MARKET will be everyone within reach of my progress. My SUPPLY will be my ability to reproduce thousands of cd's a week at extremely low costs. My supply will also be so much tactful internet advertising that you will nearly have no choice but to at least attempt to care or understand. I will not use scare tactics, or propaganda, only simple honest advertising. But this time, I will not be modest. My supply will also be a website, and a record label which will be the home base for news of progress, involvement, etc. My DEMAND will speak for itself. There are thousands of people affected by these organizations, and many of them are outraged. They are the ones who will initiate my agenda, and the wave begins with them.

Or fuck it, let's just wait and see how the internet does on it's own. Let's have a quantity battle with our governments. Let's allow them to constantly lie to everyone, while we rebuild without protection. Technology cannot take care of it's self. It needs someone to plan for it and execute an intelligent response. Like the founder of oink said, if this or the similar goes to court, it may set a very scary precedent on how we use the internet. It will give courts another open door into policing web based free speech.

Please stay out of my way. I will not let one single negative rebuttal towards my plans go misaddressed. Every attempt to break me down is bad advertising. With every action against me, I will unfortunately need to take an elicit counter-action. But I simply do not have the time. So please, if you would like to see progress, stay out of my way. Or do something yourself.

Sincerely,

Brian

Anonymous said...

lol drama

TheWhiteRhino said...

Somebody shoot Brian NOW, guy is a douchebag! What a sensitive little crybaby, hehehe I cannot stop laughing!

Dude, Brian, do you write down all your thoughts like this, in little notebooks and using a rotating key to encrypt them? Come on buddy, fess up! Do you razorblade off your fingerprints so your neighbor lady doesn't know you've been sniffing her panties?

Or WAIT! Do you, instead, have your neighbor lady chained to your radiator with duct tape over her mouth, right now? Is she watching you reading this?

I BET YOU DO, you Casanova, you!

1. You are a total freak.
2. Please stop talking, you whine like a bitch.
3. You are a total freak.
4. Please do NOT take it upon yourself to solve our collective problems concerning the RIAA. In NO way do we want a douchebag like you EVER representing us, your rage and refusal to hear polite criticism is so sad buddy, maybe you need grief counseling or something since the fall of Oink.
5. You are a TOTAL freak.